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Post by Guest on Feb 16, 2005 16:50:41 GMT -5
Not officially released news, but as of today Kim Graham was officially relieved of his duties as Athletic Director at Liberty University. I don't know why, it was kind of a suprise, maybe there is more info to come. Does anyone else have ideas?
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Post by Sly Fox on Feb 16, 2005 20:37:59 GMT -5
Wow! I hadn't heard a word. Can anybody else fill us in on what's going?
It is VERY odd to let an AD go in the middle of school year. There had to be something very serious to prompt this move.
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Post by eddantes on Feb 16, 2005 20:43:08 GMT -5
I had heard rumors about this for quite some time (nearly a year ago), but that died down to the point where I thought the axe wasn't going to drop.
Huh. Maybe AD's should be more judicious before doling out 5-year contracts to proven losers.
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Post by PAmedic on Feb 17, 2005 9:15:44 GMT -5
OUCH! (but you're right, Ed- I think that contract is REALLY gonna cost us in the long run- in more ways than one)
but WOW, and I mean WOW. guess Jerry just got tired of the whole mess? just speculation- and there will be a TON of that. anyone on campus hear anything?
strangely enough- nothing about this on the website! maybe they'll post it today! HAH
(EDIT: gave up on trying to imbed a link- removed it)
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Post by MDIVIVVY on Feb 17, 2005 9:18:23 GMT -5
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Post by PAmedic on Feb 17, 2005 9:19:31 GMT -5
how'd you do that, can't get my link to work in my post above?
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Post by PAmedic on Feb 17, 2005 9:26:38 GMT -5
read the articles- 1. the guy seems genuinely surprised- thats odd b/c when this sort of job action occurs, the employee normally knows that it is coming (from my personal exp as a supervisor who has had to fire many people over the years) 2. the man actually sounds quite depressed! not to worry, he'll no doubt get picked up very quickly by another Christian school that wants a guy from a "big name" religous institution. if that's what he's looking for.
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Post by MDIVIVVY on Feb 17, 2005 9:32:45 GMT -5
old friends cut and paste...
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Post by PAmedic on Feb 17, 2005 9:38:12 GMT -5
yeah- got too creative for my own good with the little "insert hypertext" button- duh! interesting facts in the links though, about the ice hockey rink being funded now and soon to be built (my faith in the wisdom of the athletic dept may be restored!), and what's with the upgrades to the Vine's ctr?
(EDIT: cna't typ tday!) HAH
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Post by Sly Fox on Feb 17, 2005 10:19:07 GMT -5
I guess they let him know he was going to be gone in June in order to publicly begin the search process. That shows some class. Its been my experience at covering athletic departments over the years that AD's usually are shown the exit immediately while they secretly conduct searches behin his back.
I'm guessing there must've been more wrangling going on behind the scenes than those two articles from the fishwrap indicate.
Given the fact that we don't have a large alumni association kicking in big bucks to the athletic department, it should come as NO surprise to anyone that fundraising is most certainly a major component of the AD's position. The fact it hasn't been in the past is perhaps a reason why we haven't progressed more to this point.
I am sincerely encouraged by these developments. And not because I have anything against Graham. It shows me that the school is serious about progressing forward. After the shocking 5-year contract extension for Coach Karcher, this helps me renew some of my faith in the administration.
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Post by LUconn on Feb 17, 2005 10:27:37 GMT -5
Ok, if he was told he was going to be gone 8 months ahead of time (that is really classy by the school, it makes me proud actually) who was in charge of that Karcher extension? Surely not Graham. None other than Falwell himself. He had to be the culprit. On the other hand, maybe that contract was Kim Graham's screw you farewell.
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Post by LUconn on Feb 17, 2005 10:33:18 GMT -5
I'm applying for the job. I have no experience and no fund raising capabilities. In fact, people hate me and in no way would ever give me money. Unless it was to keep me away. I wonder if they're even taking resumes for it. They probably have somebody in mind like Tim LaHay or Ken Karcher.
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Post by Sly Fox on Feb 17, 2005 10:39:04 GMT -5
My guess is they are probably taking resumes. And that's why they openly made it known Graham was done. That way they don't have to get into the cloak & dagger act.
ADs form a rather interesting clique. Word spreads like wildfire when a school starts courting candidates.
My guess is they are hoping to find a high profile name candidate (former pro athelte) who they will give the title in order for them to devote nearly all time to squeezing dollars from alumni and corporate sponsors (he'll have more success with the latter, believe me). Then they'll probably hire somebody from a small school with AD experience to become an Assistant AD in order to handle the details of the position. Just my hypothesis.
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Post by JackSparrow81 on Feb 17, 2005 13:18:15 GMT -5
Am i the only one that thinks Karcher has done a fine job. Their scheduel year in and year out has been brutal, then it was before hand. Anybody that actually that has a somewhat knowledge of football wanna step up to the plate and challenge,ay? 5 years in lengthy. It should have been 3. But still the program is moving forward.
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Post by Sly Fox on Feb 17, 2005 13:34:47 GMT -5
We've kind of worn out the Karcher extension arguement over in the football forum. Suffice it to say, you would be in the minority ofbelieving Karcher has "done a fine job". His record is mediocre at best. He's kept his job beating the dregs of the Big South and has failed to beat anyone of any consequence in his tenure.
Personally, I like the guy from my brief interaction with the man. But he works in a results-driven business and his numbers didn't deserve that lengthy of an extension (and many argue whether he deserved one at all).
That said, we all want to believe the program is moving forward. But the evidence isn't overwhelming at the moment. Perhaps the tide is turning.
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aLUmnus
Full Member
old school LU
Posts: 192
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Post by aLUmnus on Feb 17, 2005 13:39:28 GMT -5
I don't know if I necessarily bite on the fundraising excuse. But they may have wanted someone with more football experience that will know how to move the program to where they want it. A move to 1-A is a pretty big deal, and I don't know if Graham necessarily had the capacity to do that.
Also, basketball has been going OK, but when we were in need of a coach, he wasn't able to pull in anyone of note, so we went back to Dunton (which wasn't the end of the world, but still, Dunton). Recycling an old coach isn't necessarily doing a good job of filling the vacancy.
Thirdly, if the powers that be want to make a conference change just as we think they should, they may have seen the need for a change in that respect. Things haven't really improved in a while, and we seem to be stuck in a rut. Graham may have done a good job, but no advancement has really taken place, in any sport.
Just some thoughts, along with some typos I'm sure, my contacts are making everything blurry right now.
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aLUmnus
Full Member
old school LU
Posts: 192
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Post by aLUmnus on Feb 17, 2005 14:04:05 GMT -5
Kim Graham may have done a good job, but he seemed kind of passive. The athletic program needs an AD who can impose his will on the program. And especially at a school like LU, that person needs to be someone who can somewhat stand up to the upper echelon (chancellor, maybe?) and make sports-minded decisions, and not just media-minded decisions, that will further the sports program. A chancellor should not be picking who coaches a team, that's ultimately the AD's job, and he should be making the selection, along with the approval of his superiors. It's possible that Graham let himself be pushed around too much.
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Post by PAmedic on Feb 17, 2005 16:13:28 GMT -5
aLUmn: the last post was a very interesting point- hadn't thought of that: firing a guy because he wouldn't stand up to you. Could be though- interesting.
also, the word I believe you very politely danced around is STAGNANT. I agree, "ok" isn't going to cut it in D1A anymore. gotta move up or move on.
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Post by eddantes on Feb 17, 2005 17:34:08 GMT -5
You know, there's a difference between getting pushed around... and getting pushed around by Falwell.
I mean, the guy founded the school. If Falwell wants something done from you, you're gonna do it. My spidey-sense just doesn't tell me that Graham was canned because he didn't stand up to the Chancellor.
Besides, no Division I-AA football program makes money. None. You can talk about bringing sponsorships in, but like someone said earlier, that's not what the AD is supposed to do. LU had a few guys in charge of marketing recently, so the onus wasn't on Graham's head.
My best guess - honestly - is that he was good friends with Dr. Borek, and had no one to vouch for him when he left. Rumor had it that the wheels for this were in motion this summer, after Borek had left.
And to my good friend Jack Sparrow, I parrot (sorry, lousy pun) a post I made earlier in which I stated that our football schedule isn't "brutal." Here are the Sagarin ratings (a USA Today ranking) of all Division I football teams that we beat (out of 239 teams) in the last two years:
2004 - Gardner-Webb (188) Elon (200) Chattanooga (205) Charleston Southern (220) VMI (222)
2003 - Hofstra (170) VMI (194) Coastal Carolina (218) Norfolk State (228) Charleston Southern (232)
Hardly brutal. Irregardless, the damage to the program (Karcher's extension) is done, but I don't think it has anything to do with Graham's unfortunate termination.
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Post by PAmedic on Feb 17, 2005 20:25:01 GMT -5
ok then Ed- You're more in touch w/ whats going on down there than the rest of us. what's your best guess on this one (flesh out the Borek theory)?
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Post by eddantes on Feb 17, 2005 20:58:05 GMT -5
Ummmmm... Sorry to disappoint PA, but that was really the extent of my knowledge.
I liked Kim Graham. His son and my younger brother played golf a bunch of times, so I was disappointed to see what happened.
But I had heard that Graham was going to be canned about a year ago, and it was supposed to happen over the summer. Supposedly, there was a meeting and Graham managed to convince the superiors (I don't know who) to let him stay on. I guess they renegged on the deal though - so when I heard that Graham was surprised the axe dropped I thought to myself, "well how surprised could he be?"
I dunno, something had to have gone down earlier because he was doing things like fetching water for Mr. Edwards during radio broadcasts...
I don't know why he was fired, I thought he did a good job - those Sasser Cups in the office speak for themselves. If it's about money, well, you can solve that by cutting a few of our scholarship sports.
Or MAYBE (and I just thought about this one moment before I hit the "post" button) he was so tied in with the Big South Conference (being an instrumental member of the committee that made football a championship sport) that it made him really reluctant to switch conferences to a more superior one, where he would not be as prominent a figure-head. My conspiracy theory.
You know, Oswald was a patsy.
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Post by PAmedic on Feb 17, 2005 21:23:57 GMT -5
ah yes, conspiracies. quite possibly the Tri-lateral Commission was behind this whole affair! or the Masons. I won't comment on my membership in the John Birch Society.
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Post by Stevev on Feb 17, 2005 21:40:53 GMT -5
I was very encouraged by the article in the News Advance concerning the upgrades they are trying to make to the facilities and the whole program. LU needs to hire someone with more credentials than what Graham had to offer. Someone who could seriously make an effort to make improvements to all aspects of the athletic department (which in may opinion has become very stagnant in the last 5 years), the most important thing being finding a more competitive conference for all the sports programs so that recruiting, attendence, and national respect can be achieved.
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Post by Sly Fox on Feb 18, 2005 0:10:51 GMT -5
Welcome back, Steve. I agree that whoever we hire to become the new AD will have their hands full with a number of issues right from the get-go.
As for Ed, I don't believe you'll find Graham on the grassy knoll. You are stretching the confines of even a Oliver Stone theory with your Big South analogy.
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Post by PAmedic on Feb 18, 2005 2:43:17 GMT -5
Thank you Steve, as we obviously agree here: the issue is keeping LU sports from becoming STAGNANT. though some of the ideas posted here may be considered radical (conf shifts, etc) that kind of thinking is EXACTLY what is needed to stay on top. BRING ON THE NEW GUY (or girl- TopCat, submit a resume- you're a local, right?)
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aLUmnus
Full Member
old school LU
Posts: 192
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Post by aLUmnus on Feb 18, 2005 13:27:00 GMT -5
I didn't say that being a push-ever got Kim fired, I was saying that the new guy needs to have bigger juevos and be able to hold his own against the bigwigs. Falwell may be in charge, but he's a reasonable guy, not some tyrant who always gets his way. I don't notice any ties or skirts around campus these days.
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Post by eddantes on Feb 18, 2005 19:59:24 GMT -5
I don't notice any ties or skirts around campus these days. I'd like the record to show that I sided with the Chancellor on that issue.
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Post by Stevev on Feb 18, 2005 21:39:28 GMT -5
I guess I can't get too carried away about the article. I would be happy to see all the improvements talked about as well as a Atlantic 10 (football), Colonial conference setup. I don't think that is too much to ask right now.
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Post by guest on Feb 20, 2005 16:24:02 GMT -5
Lets face it, sure Kim Graham may fit all the stereotypes of he is passive and did not raise money, but the AD at Liberty has no power, it is all under the Falwells. They decide who comes in, who stays, our AD is just a paperwork man. We wont get a big name to fill the spot because no one wants a top job that in reality has no power, as soon as the people at the top let the AD take real control, then we will have Kim Graham's for as long as LU is around.
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Post by PittLU on Mar 2, 2005 10:18:51 GMT -5
Sorry to be away so long.......
I am just getting wind of Kim Graham getting fired and I have to say that Liberty WILL get a big name to fill in. Maybe this is where LU will get a big push to beef up football, men's b-ball, and move conferences.
Face it, Kim Graham did a solid job of building a successful Big South program (the Sasser Cups speek for themselves). Now, we (or most of us) agree that Karcher and the football program has been an albatrose, but with that and the Hankinson era out of the equation and you have a very respected program within the Big South. Our non-revenue sports make us look like a well-rounded and successful athletic program. Plus, there have never been any NCAA sanctions. For that, Kim Graham deserves kudos.
Now the time has come for a firebrand to come in and make a push for LU to take it to the next level. LU has the potential to market its program nationally because of its unique niche. Falwell has long said that he wants to be to the Baptist faith athletically what Notre Dame is to the Catholic faith. It makes no sense to bring in someone who will just bend to Falwells will, but it makes sense for that person to share the vision. It was quoted earlier that "Falwell is a reasonable man". If he wasnt, LU wouldnt be where they are today. Falwell has a university to consider and has to surround himself with competent people he can rely on to share his vision to grow their specific aspect of the university.
Graham did a good job to make LU a successful athletic program, but the non-revs dont get the pub. Falwell is too busy raising rev for the university to take time out from that and raise it for the athletic program. I firmly believe that LU is succeeding despite itself. Thank God that people close to Falwell are sporting enthusiests and throw money at the sports programs. Could you image Falwell and an AD with some charisma that would meet with potential donors? Kim Graham is a successful, intelligent man; but charismatic he is not (and come on - just because something isnt in your job description doesnt mean you dont do it!!!. Honestly, I dont think he is the kind of person than could inspire people to part with their cash). I know that if a name comes in, Falwell will lean alot on him to recruit funds and implement/oversee the spending. The guy just wont be a mouthpiece for Falwell - I assure that!
Man, now I am excited. Hopefully we will see some dramatic changes as far as marketing and merchandising since revenue generation seems to be a priority. Hey - maybe they need sales help. I am sending my resume.......
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