VMI?

[ATrain]

Just outta curiosity...how did VMI end up joining the Big South when they were in a conference that had an automatic football berth (SoCon)?

[jimflamesfan]

In my opinion, it was a pretty smart move for VMI to join the Big South. They hadn't won much in the Southern, and I'm pretty sure their travel expenses were higher as well. It's not like they were knocking on the door for a playoff bid.

Plus at the time they made the move, it looked like the Big South would have 6 football Schools, because Coastal was adding football, so we would have LU, VMI, Coastal, Charleston Southern, Gardner Webb, and Elon...the six required to have an automatic bid.

Then the Southern Conference (which, I've said before, is really almost a parallel conference to the Big South, not much of a step up at all...okay, maybe a baby step) got scared they would lose one of their at-large bids to the Big South winner, so they stole Elon from the Big South.

That's my opinion. I'm glad VMI is here, I do think they add to Big South football. The Big South has to work on keeping Coastal and finding another 1-AA football school.

[ATrain]

In my opinion, the SoCon has much more to fear from the CAA taking an at-large bid from them...if the SoCon does get Coastal, hopefully LU will at least make an effort to grab the CAA's attention.

[Sly Fox]

The CAA is already full for their new football league. Unless some of their schools try and jump up to I-A, then we are out of that circuit.

If I were Coastal spending the kind of jack they have been recently, I would hold out on joining the Southern Conference and aim a little higher. But by all indications, they are looking to make that move at some point.

[bigsmooth]

VMI left the SOCON b/c they could not compete. they are the 2nd smallest school in D-1 football. the SOCON has been the premier conference in I-AA football for years. (ga. southern, appy state, wofford recently) but the CAA probably has more depth. the BSC needs to get another member to make 6 teams to at least get the NCAA's attention. if coastal jumps which i do not think they will, LU should aspire to join the CAA or go independent. elon made a big mistake in leaving the BSC, as they have done nothing in the SOCON. until the BSC gets an automatic bid, our program will be spinning it's wheels

[Sly Fox]

bigsmooth --- Long time, no see. Its good to see you back on the board.

If you go to the Coastal board (as I know A-Train does regularly) you know that they are really making an effort to get in the Southern Conference. Why? I don't understand.

But you are 100% accurate that if we lose Coastal from the Big South, we'll have to go Independent in football. We just don't have any attractive suitors to join the league as football members. There remains the possibility that Presbyterian moves up from DII to give us enough members for an automatic bid. But unless Coastal remains here, it will all be for nothing.

By the way, have you guys been paying attention to what Coastal has been doing the past few days? Not only did they get a #1 seed for baseball in NCAA Regionals, but they also made some noise at the NCAA Division I Championships in golf. I believe we were fortunate to get them in our league before they began their growth spurt. If we don't have any other attractive conference options right now (and apparently we don't with the CAA being full), then its in our best interests to try and keep Coastal happy and in our league.

Believe it or not, I saw on one of the other boards that the new President at Appalachian State is interested in taking them I-A. If Appy were to leave the SoCon, that league would be even less attractive. At the same time, it might give us a partner in starting up a new league or joining a current one if we made the jump along with them. Just some food for thought or more likely, wishful thinking on my part.

[jimflamesfan]

Bigsmoot,

Still, you haven't answered the question as to why the SoCon picked up Elon from the Big South.

The real reason...the SoCon is worried about losing an at-large bid to the Big South if it had six teams. Out of all the teams they could have went after, there is no other reason for them to pick up Elon when East Tenessee State left except that they were in a hurry to keep the Big South from getting 6 teams (I bet they wished they had waited and taken Coastal instead...)

VMI hasn't done well in the Big South, either. The SoCon is a good conference, but it is not the power that it used to be...it a step up from the Big South, but a small step.

It looks like Coastal is starting to figure this out. If you look on their board, it seems that there is some second guessing...I like what Sly Said, If Coastal is going to move and spend all the money, they should try to head to the Atlantic 10.

But I do hope the Big South keeps Coastal. I don't see much of an advantage for them in most of the other sports other than the SoCon having an at-large bid in 1-AA football.

They might get a little higher seeds in the hoops tournament...

[bigsmooth]

jim, i will be glad to answer it for you. elon thought it could compete in the SOCON and it has back-fired. there educational make-up is up to par or better than any BSC school and equal to the SOCON schools, but their athletic program is a true BSC school. it was a football move, but it has clearly back-fired

[Sly Fox]

I'm guessing that publicly the folks at Elon would say it was worth the lumps they are taking in order to upgrade their football program. Privately, I'll bet they'd love to be back in the Big South where they woul dhave a shot at the league title and an automatic bid.

As our friends from DC Talk used to remind us, some people have to learn the hard way.

[question]

So the SoCon thought that Elon was the best program that it could find that fit it academically and atheletically when they lost East Tennessee State? Not just among Big South schools, but among all I-AA schools?

[Sly Fox]

No, I don't think Elon was the best of all I-AAs. It just fit the best for them at that moment in time. Elon was playing good football and it made sense geographically. I doubt the SoCon would want them now knowing what they know. Neither side benefited from that move.

And if you are asking whether or not we were in the mix, the answer is not really. But I don't know anyone who shed any tears of the move other than maybe inside the football office.