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Post by guestforever on Dec 20, 2005 16:52:27 GMT -5
It's true Dunton can't continue to talk about this team's youth and inexperience. I'm not saying it isnt true but after every game it starts to sound like excuses. I mentioned this in another thread...the games against Longwood, Lipscomb, Buffalo and now Mt. Saint Mary's are a good guage of how LU will compete against Big South teams. That doesn't mean LU will lose every conference game, but the way the teams mentioned above attack LU is close to what Liberty will see in the conference.
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Post by SamFan on Dec 20, 2005 17:00:12 GMT -5
Alright, this may come as a surprise, but the men's team is not the women's team. They are on a whole other level in terms of where they are as a program. The Men's team goal every year should be to win the Big South. The more tourney appearances we get, the more exposure, recruits coverage etc. we'll get. Everything we do is to prepare us for the Big South. Sure, winning these games would be cool and a lot less embarrassing but they don't matter. They're like preseason games to us, all because our team is not relavent in the RPI/at large teams. We can be 4-30 and if those 4 wins are in the Big South tourney we'll be a 16 seed in the tournament (probably the play-in) just like we would with most other records. Our Women's team is going to make the tournament. They're jockying for a position in it. It's like comparing apples to oranges. I've never followed the women's team but I can assure you it wasn't always like that. That is the worst excuse I have ever heard for losing to a crappy Mt. St. Mary's team. Our other sports teams win championships and pick up D-1 non-conference wins along the way. As far as Jerry... he is an old school radio guy... your not going to get any boo-yas from him. That generation is classy and understated. I kind of like it because even when we get out rear ends handed to us he is soothing to listen to.
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Post by jimflamesfan on Dec 20, 2005 17:19:50 GMT -5
SamFan,
I agree with that. Mr. Edwards may not get that excited...but I don't know if I could listen to anyone else but him when were down 51-0 or something like that to W&M in football and they are still scoring.
He just keeps announcing. I sort of like it.
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Post by bigsmooth on Dec 20, 2005 17:26:37 GMT -5
sounds like sam fan is a jerry edwards apologist! in regards to the excuses on this post, and the men's team apologists....ENOUGH!!! losing to the mount and longwood are just unacceptable. when will someone on this team step up and help out larry blair? you cannot pin everything on him b/c he will not light it up every night! the bottom line is this team is not very good. they show flashes of putting things together, but then they fall apart. i do not really see much leadership on this team. i like coach dunton, i think he is a good coach, but maybe its the system?? maybe its discipline?? maybe it's work ethic?? IMHO i do not think a meyer coached team would lsoe to longwoood or the mount with the players LU has, but that is neither here nor there at this point. if blair gets no help this year, it will be a very long season.
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Post by LUconn on Dec 20, 2005 17:29:05 GMT -5
it's not an excuse. its a fact and I was pointing it out so all you chicken littles would chill. What could Dunton say after a loss that would make you happy?
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Post by LUconn on Dec 20, 2005 17:30:25 GMT -5
PS could we all get over Meyer?
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Post by bigsmooth on Dec 20, 2005 18:09:59 GMT -5
waaaaah! let me get you a tissue! keep being an apologist.
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Post by Down with Leon on Dec 20, 2005 18:20:23 GMT -5
Anybody notice Mt. St. Mary's 2 wins...Liberty and Binghamton? Dunton's last 2 schools. So ...when does he have to start taking some of the blame? Youth, staff losses, player losses...how many more excuses do we need to hear. How many of these is he directly attributed to? I think all three. He is in his 4th year. 3 recruiting classes. Yeah...he won a championship, but at least 3 of the players that contributed to that championship were from Hankinson's team. It's quite embarrasing to not have a division 1 win going into the Christmas break. Scary part is, it could still be a while before he gets that first D1 win. Is this what we want out of our MBB team?
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Post by SamFan on Dec 20, 2005 18:24:43 GMT -5
Wow... this thread is fun. I'm glad I found this place.
I was around when Meyer left, Dunton was interim, and Hankinson came in. I will say this... I was shocked that LU hired Dunton the 2nd time... b/c of the turmoil around his leaving the first time. But at the same time, I thought he would be a good x's and o's coach.
That showed true his first couple years... but we haven't built on that success. We have taken a step back. It seems like people (coaches and players) are leaving his program at will. The opposite should be happening... we should be getting better and keeping the players that are good. So I guess in that regard I agree with Biggy Smooth.
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Post by bigsmooth on Dec 20, 2005 18:38:47 GMT -5
welcome Sam Fan! yes, we do get into some good discussions here. why not go ahead and register and join the fun in the firehouse!
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Post by flamesfan710 on Dec 20, 2005 19:41:24 GMT -5
I am NOT encouraged by this at all...I hope that this won't end up like the season Hankinson was there (which I think was the year before I got to LU). I don't think the students can put up with too much more mediocrity
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Post by LUDS on Dec 20, 2005 19:52:12 GMT -5
What did Randy Dunton do to you people... other than give you a championship (two for that matter) and bring up the team's standards on and off the court. Meyer needed ran off, Hankinson should have been fired after two years and as far as I'm concerned this should be Randy's job as long as he wants it. He is what LU is all about... there is no other coach on that campus that has the same passion for the university as he does.
Everyone has a slow start now and then... this team will be fine.
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A.G.
Junior Member
Posts: 62
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Post by A.G. on Dec 20, 2005 19:53:30 GMT -5
OK. Try this: "We're young and only 4 plays away from a 5-3 record."
Remember that when you think it can't get any worse.
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Post by thesportscritic on Dec 20, 2005 20:03:33 GMT -5
LUconn I was citing LU women's basketball team as an example about youth. I am shocked you even mentioned the Women's team. Haven't heard you talk about them on this board since late March. AG you are still using the youth excuse. Enough already with that excuse. This is what happened last season around this time. No D1 wins until Marist in late December or whenever we beat them last season at their place.
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A.G.
Junior Member
Posts: 62
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Post by A.G. on Dec 20, 2005 20:57:01 GMT -5
thesportscritic: You fail to note heavy sarcasm when you read it. I was quoting KARCHER. Geesch. Would you feel better if I said that Coach Dunton was a despicable human being and is getting what he deserves, or would you rather me help rally around him like I'm attempting to do?
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Post by jcmanson on Dec 20, 2005 20:59:36 GMT -5
I wish all you guys would stop calling for Coach's head. Let's at least wait until the end of the season before we start a fire dunton thread. He deserves that right given what he has done in the past. And as mentioned above, these non-conference games aren't going to make or break a season. It's the conference and tournament that matter. Not that I don't want to and expect to win every game we suit up for.
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tallyw
Junior Member
Posts: 53
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Post by tallyw on Dec 20, 2005 21:08:40 GMT -5
Alumni bases are supposed to be supportive but also firm. Alumni put pressure on the University to improve where sometimes the University would stand pat. In my experience with LU, I honestly can't see Dunton being a mastermind. We didn't blow everyone away the year we did win the BSC.
As Alumni we should be frustrated and providing a nice nudge. We should also show up and show support and (as some have suggested) financially support the programs.
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Post by PAmedic on Dec 20, 2005 22:00:34 GMT -5
Alumni bases are supposed to be supportive but also firm. Alumni put pressure on the University to improve where sometimes the University would stand pat. In my experience with LU, I honestly can't see Dunton being a mastermind. We didn't blow everyone away the year we did win the BSC. As Alumni we should be frustrated and providing a nice nudge. We should also show up and show support and (as some have suggested) financially support the programs. TALLY with the best take on this so far. Support Coach D or don't support Coach D. As Alumni- its our job to nudge and push and financially support the program. we're finally developing a big enough base to do that effectively. oh- and AG- I got the Karcher ref! good one!
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Post by HoldMyOwn on Dec 20, 2005 22:16:41 GMT -5
is this a true statement:
The first year Coach D was here we were 2nd in the BS The Second Year Coach D was here we won the BS The third year Coach D was here we were 2nd in the BS
Is that right??? I'm being foreal b/c I have Dial up and dont feel like waiting to see if this info is correct
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Post by thesportscritic on Dec 20, 2005 22:17:33 GMT -5
thesportscritic: You fail to note heavy sarcasm when you read it. I was quoting KARCHER. Geesch. Would you feel better if I said that Coach Dunton was a despicable human being and is getting what he deserves, or would you rather me help rally around him like I'm attempting to do? Blah Blah Blah AG. It is hard to read sarcasm on this board. My point is that using youth as an excuse back to back years is not good to me. Don't get me started on Karcher, I am sure that he is a good person but didn't get it done. Ever since our championship in the Big South, we have not gotten better, this team has taken steps backwards. A team with youth is suppose to get better everygame but this team hasn't. I don't see anybody stepping up to the plate to help Larry Blair in terms of scoring and this team is not tough mentally by any means.
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Post by thesportscritic on Dec 20, 2005 22:23:49 GMT -5
is this a true statement: The first year Coach D was here we were 2nd in the BS The Second Year Coach D was here we won the BS The third year Coach D was here we were 2nd in the BS Is that right??? I'm being foreal b/c I have Dial up and dont feel like waiting to see if this info is correct Sure we have been competitive in the Big South but we are not beating teams we are suppose to beat. (Longwood, Mt. St Mary, Lipscomb) We continue to make scrub teams look good when they struggle before playing LU. This team has not put everything together on the floor to win these games.
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Post by thesportscritic on Dec 20, 2005 22:25:38 GMT -5
I wish all you guys would stop calling for Coach's head. Let's at least wait until the end of the season before we start a fire dunton thread. He deserves that right given what he has done in the past. And as mentioned above, these non-conference games aren't going to make or break a season. It's the conference and tournament that matter. Not that I don't want to and expect to win every game we suit up for. So I guess the object for this team is to lose every D1 game in our preconference schedule and lose to scrub teams in our preconference schedule (Lipscomb, Mt St Mary, Longwood) before the Conference play begins? Not a good formula.
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Post by HoldMyOwn on Dec 20, 2005 22:41:07 GMT -5
is this a true statement: The first year Coach D was here we were 2nd in the BS The Second Year Coach D was here we won the BS The third year Coach D was here we were 2nd in the BS Is that right??? I'm being foreal b/c I have Dial up and dont feel like waiting to see if this info is correct Sure we have been competitive in the Big South but we are not beating teams we are suppose to beat. (Longwood, Mt. St Mary, Lipscomb) We continue to make scrub teams look good when they struggle before playing LU. This team has not put everything together on the floor to win these games. Not my question...my question, is that an accurate statement about how we finished in the Reg. Season? 2nd 1st 2nd
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Post by thesportscritic on Dec 20, 2005 22:48:59 GMT -5
Sure we have been competitive in the Big South but we are not beating teams we are suppose to beat. (Longwood, Mt. St Mary, Lipscomb) We continue to make scrub teams look good when they struggle before playing LU. This team has not put everything together on the floor to win these games. Not my question...my question, is that an accurate statement about how we finished in the Reg. Season? 2nd 1st 2nd That is accurate HMO.
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Post by jimflamesfan on Dec 20, 2005 22:55:58 GMT -5
LU did blow good teams away under Dunton when they won the big south...see the Chattanooga game.
Also, we hung with Duke for a half that year, and also didn't lose that badly to Iowa St or Arizona.
Would you rather have the Hankinson era, where we 7 of our first 8 games, (including wins over JMU and Townson), and then couldn't win a Big South game?
I'd rather get better than worse.
I think because Dunton did win a championship, (ONLY THE 2nd BIG SOUTH championship in school history), that he deserves a "grace period".
I think this year we had a lot of turnover, and Elijah Miller was a major loss.
One thing I would like to see is for us to go ahead and play the big kid that transferred...I think we need some help at the post to turn things around...and with all the turnover, play kids while you have them.
Anyway, I'll still be onboard with Dunton this year...waiting to see how the season pans out...
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Post by HoldMyOwn on Dec 20, 2005 22:59:08 GMT -5
So let me get this right....some of you guys are tellin us that Coach D is a bad coach meanwhile the last three years he's finished the reg. season 2nd, 1st, 2nd....I think we just found our problem some LU fans are Impossible to play or coach for...there's not much more you could ask out of someone then those last 3 seasons...we forget Hankinson WAY to quick when we finish dead last in the BS year after year after year after...you get the point....D has earned the respect for us to at least get off his back and support him and hope that we have ANOTHER good run in the Big South...and forbid we finish 3rd or 4th FOR THE FIRST TIME WHILE HE"S BEEN A COACH...i just dont understand
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Post by Sly Fox on Dec 20, 2005 23:22:53 GMT -5
It seems like every season we are frustrated heading into the New Year and then have our fortunes suddenly turn toward the better shortly thereafter. It'd be great if that cycle could include more early success. But I'm confident things are going to settle down here shortly.
Perhaps we should rename this forum the Henhouse because all of the Chicken Littles on here.
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Post by HoldMyOwn on Dec 20, 2005 23:36:20 GMT -5
I'd say losing Miller could be a bigger loss then Dee's b/c he is that inside presense that we're missing right now, not to mention his speed, he could beat guards down the court...right said Jim he is deserving of a grace period
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Post by SamFan on Dec 20, 2005 23:48:45 GMT -5
I might be wrong, but I think the reason there are so many "Chicken Littles" is because the way things happened. After the mass exodus over the summer I think that leads some of us to feel the problem is deeper than face value.
Plus, you have Dunton apologists saying things like...
is this a true statement:
The first year Coach D was here we were 2nd in the BS The Second Year Coach D was here we won the BS The third year Coach D was here we were 2nd in the BS
Is that right??? I'm being foreal b/c I have Dial up and dont feel like waiting to see if this info is correct
When they obviously KNOW that is correct. When someone tries to insult your intelligence it doesn't go well toward supporting your argument.
I think everyone on here is in agreement that we have done well in the BS. The problem is that the BS is one of the worst conferences on Earth. If it wasn't for Winthrop the BS would be at the same level as the CIAA or ODAC. We should strive to be better than a good BS team with an RPI higher than a coaches cholesterol.
I thought the vision was Top 50... we are going in the wrong direction. My memory is not good but when we did win it we were a 16 seed and missed the play-in only because there were some upsets. I'm guessing we were in the neighborhood of 150. Right now we are 321. I think that justifies some concern.
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Post by realist on Dec 20, 2005 23:54:13 GMT -5
The answer is somewhere in the middle. You guys are starting one guy from last year. One. You have all brand new post players who have never seen the court and are adjusting to the speed of the game. You have a pg who is the floor leader for the first time in his college career. You weren't going to come out the gates beating everyone, though I would expect a couple wins. I expect LU will get better. As for Dunton, doesn't every coach deserve grace period of 4 years after a championship? It seems a little shady with the players leaving, and the year he won the BS was a very down year for the league with the WU injuries and UNCA losing 4 seniors from the year before (the year they won) but he still did it. I just thought that was a general rule, win a champ=at least 3 or 4 more years.
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