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Post by Guest on Mar 3, 2005 23:39:11 GMT -5
I don't know if anyone else is noticing what is going on with our basketball team, but I can speak with full confidence in what I am talking about and tell you that it is correct information. The best thing that could happen to the Men's basketball team right now would be to see a coaching change. Randy Dunton is an absolute lunatic that not many players enjoy playing for. The other night there is no one to blame for losing the game other than Dunton, Jim Platt out coached him and that is why he has his team in the championship game on Saturday. Rumors are going all around campus that Dees and Blair are on their way out and it would not surprise me if they did. Blair is a prolific scorer and could be the all-time score here at Liberty but for some reason he is not used that way. ACC schools are always wanting him to leave here and go elsewhere and it would do nothing but benefit him. The thing that is keeping here him now is the fact that he is the man they signed two years ago and he wants to fulfill the commitment he made, and for that I have the upmost respect for him because if it were me and I had his talent I would say screw the Big South. Dees is another player that schools that are big time Mid-major are wanting him to transfer and it would be great for him also, he is too good to stay here and just not be used to his full potential.
This is something that I think should happen, Dunton needs to be out of here and they just need to allow Coach Davis to take the reigns. This would probably ensure that most players would stay rather than having to bring in a whole new coaching staff, plus from what I have heard, the current team loves the way Coach Davis coaches and he has an impressive coaching background. It is an absolute travesty and an embarrassment that Dunton acts the way he does on the sidelines, he in no way is exemplifying what this school stands for and I do not know why Dr. Falwell or anyone else should have to put up with this.
I think that the only way our basketball team will return to the status of what it was last year would be that Dunton be relieved of his duties, I think he has officially started his last fire in the furnace and he might get burned by it.
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Post by PAmedic on Mar 4, 2005 9:37:28 GMT -5
I am confident the school will have the new AD in place by this summer, and I am SURE that the health of our big sports will be one of the first things on his/her agenda.
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Post by Sly Fox on Mar 4, 2005 10:28:25 GMT -5
Guest --- Let me take a wild guess that you and Randy aren't tight these days.
There is no question that life is not perfect in the program. But show me one where everybody is happy with their touches and the players are infatuated with their head coach.
Since it has been brought up now for the second time, perhaps someone could let us know what the contract situation is for Coach Dunton. As evidenced by our football scenario, contract extensions come fairly easy these days. But as mentioned by our myopic Pennsylvanian above, a new AD won't have the same allegiances as Graham.
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Post by jimflamesfan on Mar 4, 2005 10:50:15 GMT -5
Rumors are stupid.
From the way Dees talked during the tournament interview, it sounds like he'll be back.
I agree with Sly Fox that players often don't like their head coaches, but like the assistant coaches.
Before Dunton we were last in the Big South three years in a row. After Dunton LU hasn't finished lower than 2nd.
Charleston Southern proved that beating LU was not a fluke by also beating High Point on the road.
Winthrop will beat them though (unless martin hurt his arm last night).
If Dees and Blair don't return and the Flames crash and burn next year, then you can make your argument that Dunton should be gone. But as far as right now, everything that is complained about is speculation.
There's no solid reason to fire him yet. You have to at least give him a year to crash and burn. I haven't seen that yet.
What I saw this year was Dunton taking a team that had no solid post player, and still winning a lot of games.
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Post by jimflamesfan on Mar 4, 2005 10:53:33 GMT -5
Guest,
If you can speak with full confidence, why don't you register for this site?
We don't even know who you are or where your info comes from! That's why rumers are stupid.
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Post by LUconn on Mar 4, 2005 12:01:31 GMT -5
Rumors are stupid. Before Dunton we were last in the Big South three years in a row. After Dunton LU hasn't finished lower than 2nd. Ken Karcher was signed to a 5 year extension. Dunton is going nowhere. He's brought nothing but success to this program even before he was head coach. Just ask yourself how long Mel was here and how many times he finished 2nd in the conference. I can't stand this crap of people on the "inside" that are just taking blind guesses. Register and you might get some credability, but probably not. |
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Post by JackSparrow81 on Mar 4, 2005 14:40:51 GMT -5
If I was a betting man, I wouldn't be suprised if the guest initials were JM and that he was a travelin man from deep south
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Post by Stevev on Mar 4, 2005 20:14:17 GMT -5
I can't imagine LU loosing both Blair and Dees. I would like to confirm the seriousness of this rumor. There is no reason to fire Dunton right now. I think that he did a good job this year in salvaging would could have been a disasterous season even though the success was in the Big South. Next year if Blair and Dees do come back I think that LU could possibly have one of there best seasons ever if things pan out the way there supposed to. A lot depends on Elijah Miller and the next underclassman who steps up as expected.
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Post by MDIVIVVY on Mar 4, 2005 20:55:28 GMT -5
Um, is there some way we can't restrict guests from starting topics if this is to be the result. Haven't we been over all of this already on this board. Could he or she have read what we ALL already typed. Geez, is Dunton emotionally involved. Heck yeah and I would expect him to be. Yelling and such aside, he has gotten results which is part of his job. As far as his Christian character, I wouldn't question it as I don't have any, how you say, "inside information". I know if you judged me on just certain parts you would ask why I was in seminary. I have bad days. I dunno. I just wish people would think before they type!
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Post by Realist on Mar 4, 2005 20:57:22 GMT -5
Where are these rumors coming from???
If either one goes, it's going to be a walk in the park for WU again next year, they lose one senior, who sees about 2 mins per game.
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Post by krh44 on Mar 4, 2005 21:55:01 GMT -5
I don't know what the deal is with Dunton. I helped w/ the team when he was there with Meyer and he reminded me of my high school coach, yelling & screaming. No one liked that but we worked hard and were well coached. Like someone mentioned Dunton has lead LU to a couple of 2nd place finish which is incredible since LU was dead last in division 1 history under Hankinson. Which that should never happen. So anything to this point is incredible. How difficult was it for Dutton trying to recruit when LU was dead last when he took over. Either way you have to give a coach 4 to 5 years so he can have coached with his recruits for 4 years.
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Post by LU Fan on Mar 5, 2005 1:01:16 GMT -5
Although I don't know all the information that was said by the guest I will be one to say I will agree with all of you about the results of Duntons record...but these rumors and problems don't result back to W's and L's. There is a lot going on behind the scenes, and although you cant argue his record, which I for one do agree with, you can't deny the success...its the path taken to the success which is under a lot speculation right now. As for me there is is good reason why I am not publically registered. Just forget all the rumors right now, I will keep you all updated what is happening...things should come out before the end of next week.
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Post by Sly Fox on Mar 5, 2005 11:09:00 GMT -5
Today's athletes never want to be vocally confronted. After playing AAU ball, they are accustomed to be cottled and above the reproach of a coach. As a result, anytime there is a strongwilled coach that pushes old school discipline, there will always be a backlash. Times have changed mightily in the past decade due to summer ball. It doesn't mean today's athletes are bad kids. It just means they have been conditioned improperly by AAU coaches (and now HS coaches as well). Dunton clearly hasn't adjusted to a calmer, gentler coaching style that the players prefer. And perhaps adjustments would help the situation. But the bottom line is that some discipline is necessary to show significant improvement.
All that said, unlike some of you on this board who apparently have some direct contact with the players, I am speaking strictly as an outsider who is witnessing similar situations on other DI squads where I do have direct contact. If any of what I said resonates with the "insiders" on this board, I'd be curious to hear a response.
Once again, everything is innuendo and hearsay. Its part of what makes a board great and dangerous at the same time. But I think most everyone on here wants what is in the best interest of everyone involved to come to fruition. And I just don't see how transferring is good for anyone.
Now if David is wanting to be home closer to family in Ohio, I can respect that. You have to keep your priorities in order. Sitting out a year is severe recourse for such a move. And as several former players have mentioned before on this board, LU Bible credits don't easily transfer hampering the process even further. But we don't know everyone's full story.
As for making a move to an ACC school that has been sending out the informal word to a player (despite NCAA regulations), I think that is a gamble that is less likely to pay dividends. Often times players transfer to a school because that school has a particular need at their position. But by the time they sit out the year after transfer, two recruiting classes of prepsters and JUCOs will also have time to enter and fill the gap. Do you think a major conference coach would stop recruiting a need position because a transfer will possibly be available to help in over a year? Obviously not. Rarely do Division I transfers work out for the player. But if a player is willing to make the sacrifice of practicing & not playing for an entire year PLUS accepting a greatly reduced number of touches, then perhaps a transfer is worth all the hassle.
Sorry for the epistle, but these type threads really get under my skin.
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Post by WinthropEagleFan on Mar 5, 2005 11:53:41 GMT -5
Unless something bigger is going on, I don't understand why you guys would want Dunton out...most winning coaches are hard on their players and yell and scream. Gregg Marshall at Winthrop has had quite a few players quit or transfer because he was 'too hard on them', but at the same time, I don't think the program would be where it is now if he wasn't as tough as he is.
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Post by eddantes on Mar 5, 2005 12:26:28 GMT -5
This is ridiculous, it really is - and I think I've established myself as someone who would be quick to fire one of our big coaches (I've said many times to get rid of Karcher, and I'll go on record as to saying that we should start thinking of alternatives if Carey Green doesn't win a tournament game).
I'm not sure how much more I can add to this conversation, because if Dunton turning the program around after being last isn't justification enough, I don't know what is.
With the rumors going around about Blair and Dees, let's put it this way - you're used to winning championships, but then you lose in your second year. Would you be satisfied with the way things are going?
As for the way that Blair and Dees are used, the two went #2 and #3 in the conference in scoring (and Dees led the league in conference-only points per game).
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Post by The Insider on Mar 5, 2005 16:50:26 GMT -5
It's official...because of his grace and style, Dunton has been reassigned to coach the club sport figure skating program that will begin next fall when the ice rink is built. In other developments, Lou Holtz has been named the new football coach and John Wooden, at 110 yrs of age, is coming out of retirement to coach the basketball team. Holtz and Wooden will live at the revived Liberty Village. Also, after an extensive national search Martha Stewart has been named the new Athletic Director. She will also serve as Dean of the new Liberty Culinary Institute. You will be able to follow these developments next Fall on the new FOX reality show "The University". I will keep you posted on any other "official" developments.
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Post by belcherboy on Mar 5, 2005 21:06:24 GMT -5
and I'll go on record as to saying that we should start thinking of alternatives if Carey Green doesn't win a tournament game). C'mon now, Green too?? The reason the girls don't win a tournament game is because they play a top 10 team every year in the opening game. That will not change unless we can beat a top 10 team in our out of conference schedule or move to a "better" conference. The NCAA doesn't care too much about our success when they look at our conference strength. Unfortunately, we are not a top 25 program and therefore will be lucky to win one game against a top 10 team in our next 50 games. How many 1-3 seeds have lost in the first round in the history of the women's tournament anyway? If we get into a decent conference and win, than we could see our luck change (at least our seed change). Right now, we just don't stand much of a chance. (although I'm crossing my fingers this year) My opinion is that Green leaves for a bigger program. Not many with his resume would stick around in the Big South. I'm sure he has been contacted on more than one occasion by a bigger program. If Liberty is still in the Big South in the next 2 seasons, I predict Green leaves. (not fired, but leaves) |
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Post by FireHouseRocks on Mar 6, 2005 15:19:51 GMT -5
I'm new to the board so I may not be up on all the in's and out's but going by the one poster it doesn't sound as if his (Dunton) record or coaching style is the reason for pending issues. I may be reading this wrong but it sounded to me that violations may be the reason. Like I said, maybe I'm reading the post wrong.
Also, not knowing anybody on the board I shouldn't form too many negative first impressions but Ed is suggesting that Green should come under fire? He has kept his team in the top 60 of the RPI since he got there and has a highly rated recruiting class coming in. I don't think any other coach in the history of the conference (men or women) has ever done that.
The league's RPI kills his program and it is amazing he is able to recruit into such a low league. Maybe the new AD will be able to get LU into a better league like the Colonial. That would help basketball and would be a God Send for football.
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Post by Stevev on Mar 6, 2005 20:28:47 GMT -5
I agree totally with your comments. The Big South is really degrading the whole athletic department and it is a shame and embarrassment for LU to be a part of such a disgrace. The womens basketball team must make a move (hopefully to the Colonial conference) or risk loosing coach Green which could result in the degradation of the program. In the other sports programs just look at our performance in the non-conference part of our schedules and see that this conference simply does not bring in the type of recruits that we need to be competitive at this level.
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Post by MDIVVIVY on Mar 6, 2005 20:35:38 GMT -5
okay this "insider" crap is really starting to tick me off. You know, we used to play this game as kids saying one thing but never finishing and try to make other people guess. Look, either you post what you have "insider" or to quote mike and mike "JUST SHUT UP" It's easy to say you have info, but a lot different when you post it with proof. I'm not sticking up for Duton, I'm just saying that if he's done something wrong, straight up tell us or at least E-mail the moderator who is a respectable and upright guy and he can say if you are really telling the truth or not. I understand protecting ID but "phantom" is all you are right now
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Post by PAmedic on Mar 7, 2005 7:20:55 GMT -5
ok- I never met Dunton, never saw a team of his play: I believe it was still Meyer's team when I was down there, but I've observed this thread for a while and 2 points stand out.
#1- you can't recruit to this school; there is very little draw unless the player WANTS to be here. in that respect, Dunton has done very well.
#2- (and SLY beat me to this one, as usual!) Dunton is obviously "Old school". Call me an old hag, but there is nothing wrong w/ that. You may not like- or agree w/- Bobby Knight, but the man delivers wins for his teams. Same w/ Wooden, same w/ Lou Holtz, etc. All screamers and/or borderline abusers! But from their AD's perspective: WINNERS. that's how it goes in major college sports. The main difference is LU has a different philosophy and Christian approach to sports- not that it makes it IMPOSSIBLE to win, but the big schools- well, lets just all agree that some compromises are made in order to win.
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Post by PAmedic on Mar 7, 2005 7:23:14 GMT -5
and lighten up on the anon guest! people like to stir the pot- no one says you have to believe him! if he/she is wrong, the facts will bear that out and all credibility will be lost anyway! I don't rent space in my head to people like that- just good for amusement!
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Post by The Insider on Mar 7, 2005 8:26:25 GMT -5
MDIV...whatever...My "insider" comments about Lou Holtz, John Wooden, and Martha Stewart coming to Liberty were a JOKE. I can't beleive I actually have to explain this but "The Insider" post was just to have a little fun with the rumors and speculation. It's fiction. The Insider means no harm. By the way, I did discover that the Pope has been named the new director of Alumni relations. Can anyone confirm this?
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Post by MDIVIVVY on Mar 7, 2005 12:54:29 GMT -5
Sorry "Insider" I wasn't talking about you. Honestly. Obviously using hyperbole. My real beef is with the person who started this topic. Again, I apologize if you think I was talking about you.
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Post by PAmedic on Mar 7, 2005 13:45:00 GMT -5
Hey, if Bono can run the World Bank, why can't the pope be our AD? of course, he'd have to convert to a Southern Baptist and listen to Blue Grass. Oh no, I think that's for BJU. my mistake.
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Post by LU Fan on Mar 7, 2005 16:48:49 GMT -5
[quote author=PAmedic
#1- you can't recruit to this school; there is very little draw unless the player WANTS to be here. in that respect, Dunton has done very well.
That is actually wrong to which most people would believe. Liberty actually has one of the better recruiting oppertunities in the Big South. Stephon Leary does a great job with attracting big name players here. Freshman Evan Risher and Rell Porter both came from the #1 AAU Team in Texas in which 5 of their teammates went D1. Steph has even commented on 3 or 4 players that are now playing in the Big 12 that RD actually turned down. I can not remember the names of all of the guys but i know that the Fresh PG at Texas A&M was quoted in newspapers saying LU didnt give him an offer. And we have Elijah Miller from Univ of Houston...Blair/Dees ect. not to mention the players we could have had. Steph said at one point last year that we had the talent (in recruits)to compete in Conf. USA. I think we do a great job of recruiting, its a matter of giving the players the paperwork and actually getting them to play.
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Post by PAmedic on Mar 7, 2005 19:18:02 GMT -5
That is actually wrong to which most people would believe. WHAT? since my English to ... well, whatever that was in leiu of English... translator is broken- I only understood part of your post. Let me clarify- in terms of recruiting ability, I was drawing a comparison to regular D1 schools- NOT the Big South. As schools in our conf go, I'm sure we DO out-recruit them- we are also two or three times their size. Let's aspire a bit higher here; its a given that we should be able to draw better than the bottom 7 teams in the nation. |
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Post by LU Fan on Mar 7, 2005 19:30:48 GMT -5
Sorry for the confusion...I meant we recruit a lot better than most would believe.
And I do Agree with you, but my point was we had the oppertunity to have a talent level to compete in the Conference USA. (Domnique Kirk T a-m, and player at Texas, and another person in Big 12, i will try to get names) This is why I have put this under the topic, I do not think the right decision are being made at the top with the caliber of players we COULD have, not to say our guys are bad.
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Post by LibertySportsFan on Mar 7, 2005 19:54:29 GMT -5
Over the past few days as people have responded to something that I brought about on here, I just have to sit back and laugh at every one who wants to complain about just "rumors" being started. I could really care less if you have a problem with something I say and that I started this under a Guest name. There is really no reason for me to have to identify myself on here or try and convince you what I am saying is true. All I will say is that in the next two months I will guarantee things will go down, i.e. players leaving, staff leaving, and I promise you that it will not be leaving under good terms. There is way too much that is going to happen over the next few months and I do not see how any of this is healthy for a program, especially one that is at the level of D-1 basketball that we are at. With the success that Winthrop had this year and with them being able to bring every one back next year, plus getting new recruits, I do not think that there is any chance at all that we can afford to lose anybody that we have right now. A player like Blair and Dees doesn't commit to our school everyday and will not be easy to replace which will probably only mean that bad seasons could be on the way. It would be a shame to start heading in the wrong direction because there is a problem with the one that is in charge right now.
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Post by Stevev on Mar 7, 2005 20:42:14 GMT -5
I hope to God that these rumors are just that (Rumors). I guess we will see what happens in the next couple months.
As far as recruiting goes we should be able to out recruit anyone in the Big South. Our enrollment is higher and our facilities are far superior to anyone in the conference and, assuming that we are winning we have by far the biggest fan base many times over. We still lack a few things to be able to recruit on the national scene but the conference that we are in kind of puts a cap on what we can do.
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